Discussion:
... and the Harper Fragment, also due to the neurological damage?
(too old to reply)
piotr....@gmail.com
2020-08-18 17:52:59 UTC
Permalink
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"

I was explaining to one of the members of the JFK Numbers team -world
class 3D designers and scientists- the following:

"There are two simulation categories.

(a) Hollywood: If I tell the author that upon impact flower bouquets and a
choir of angels emerged from the victim's cranium and chest, they will do
exactly that.

(b) Mathematics and Physics based, Finite Element Analysis/Computational
Fluid Dynamics (FEA/CFD). (**)

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPJIiEREC5GipycH-M6OsSP3

If I ask them:

"After impact the force vector was such and such, and the body snapped
here and there".

They will reply:

"Ramon, I don't care how much you paid us (actually you are stinking
cheap, aren't you, Mister Supported-by-The-Kennedys Herrera?), all we can
do is fire the projectile, from any location and angle, weapon of your
choice, bullet of any caliber, hitting any desired spot in the cranium
model with the maximum precision, wind speed and direction, temperature,
barometric pressure, sun position, cloud coverage ...

.. from then on, the Immutable Laws of Physics are strictly followed by
the best software in the world (**).

This is the full collection of head shots so far. It is unique in the
world. As you can see, there has been plenty of progress along the years.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPK8OH2ix3yVUO2fm67yonGN

But -as usual- I digress.

What was the explanation for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the
limo? And its disappearance?

The Random Neurological Damage, too?

-Ramon
JFK Numbers

ps: There is a 3rd. category:

(c) Utter bullshit, proclaimed by people who have absolutely no clue about
Forensic Cases where Ballistics of Cranium and Cerebrum are involved, or
the minimal required education, such as the Haags (father and son),
"scholar" (RLMAO) Larry "Put Your Photon Torpedo in my Torpedo Bay, Mr.
Spock" Sturdivan, the "scientists" from the Boston University School of
Medicine (who never signed the "definite" study paid with the Koch credit
card), Gerald Posner, Esquire (or his faithful secretary Dale Lyers),
Michael Maden, Vince DiMaio, etc.

http://jfknumbers-forum.org/The_Time_Machine/forensic/boston-university-school-medicine.html

(**) ANSYS, in Explicit Dynamics mode, used to study events of large
energy, short duration:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BydXldbRY__vRUtNWTNTQTZSQzg
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-18 23:37:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
Random> What are you babbling about?

Can you descibe and.or diagram what you mean? Have you seen the photos of
the brain? Does it tell you where the bullet came from and where it went?
Can you see the two trails of debris exiting the left side of his head?
Post by ***@gmail.com
I was explaining to one of the members of the JFK Numbers team -world
"There are two simulation categories.
(a) Hollywood: If I tell the author that upon impact flower bouquets and a
choir of angels emerged from the victim's cranium and chest, they will do
exactly that.
(b) Mathematics and Physics based, Finite Element Analysis/Computational
Fluid Dynamics (FEA/CFD). (**)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPJIiEREC5GipycH-M6OsSP3
"After impact the force vector was such and such, and the body snapped
here and there".
Show what you mean by here and there.
Post by ***@gmail.com
"Ramon, I don't care how much you paid us (actually you are stinking
cheap, aren't you, Mister Supported-by-The-Kennedys Herrera?), all we can
do is fire the projectile, from any location and angle, weapon of your
choice, bullet of any caliber, hitting any desired spot in the cranium
model with the maximum precision, wind speed and direction, temperature,
barometric pressure, sun position, cloud coverage ...
.. from then on, the Immutable Laws of Physics are strictly followed by
the best software in the world (**).
This is the full collection of head shots so far. It is unique in the
world. As you can see, there has been plenty of progress along the years.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPK8OH2ix3yVUO2fm67yonGN
But -as usual- I digress.
What was the explanation for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the
limo? And its disappearance?
The Random Neurological Damage, too?
-Ramon
JFK Numbers
(c) Utter bullshit, proclaimed by people who have absolutely no clue about
Forensic Cases where Ballistics of Cranium and Cerebrum are involved, or
the minimal required education, such as the Haags (father and son),
"scholar" (RLMAO) Larry "Put Your Photon Torpedo in my Torpedo Bay, Mr.
Spock" Sturdivan, the "scientists" from the Boston University School of
Medicine (who never signed the "definite" study paid with the Koch credit
card), Gerald Posner, Esquire (or his faithful secretary Dale Lyers),
Michael Maden, Vince DiMaio, etc.
http://jfknumbers-forum.org/The_Time_Machine/forensic/boston-university-school-medicine.html
(**) ANSYS, in Explicit Dynamics mode, used to study events of large
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BydXldbRY__vRUtNWTNTQTZSQzg
piotr....@gmail.com
2020-08-31 01:13:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
Random> What are you babbling about?
Can you describe and or diagram what you mean? Have you seen the photos of
the brain? Does it tell you where the bullet came from and where it went?
Can you see the two trails of debris exiting the left side of his head?
No, no, no and no. Contrary to you people, I am not qualified.

Let me write this for the 100th. time.

I am not a scientist, nor play one in Usenet, much less on TV. I did NOT
go to MIT, which I consider my adoptive Alma Mater. Worked there, as an
Internet pioneer and co-founder.

My only job here is to build the baseball park.

"If you build it, they will come".

I will be the boy in the cheap seats cheering the best moves *BY BOTH
TEAMS*. May the best team with. Let Science decide. Science never fails to
find The Truth.

We at JFK Numbers have:

- No position
- No theories
- No hypotheses

What do we want to [dis]prove, then?

Absolutely NOTHING. What we have is a few questions, all of numerical
nature. Out of respect to The People we demand those questions to be
answered by The Authoritative Entities.

-Ramon The Builder of the Baseball Park
JFK Numbers

ps: Okay, I will address the "random" issue. Imagine that you are really
pissed at your PC, take a gun and shoot it. The official version claims
that in response, the PC will display a tic-tac-toe and a synthesized
voice will greet you. Sturdivan, an inept, totally unqualified to deal
with Forensic Cases that involve Cranium and Cerebrum ballistics claims
that some muscles are stronger.



Number of qualified supporters: ZERO.

No human head:
- Simulated or real
- Alive or dead

has ever jumped toward the gun. So, do we have a consensus? Should science
study the case? Should simulations track down the Harper's Fragment?

Can we see a show of hands? When did calendars and clocks stop running for
you? According to the Myeristas, in 2003, others say 2013. Any bets on
what will happen in 2023?
Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)
2020-09-01 04:16:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@gmail.com
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
Random> What are you babbling about?
Can you describe and or diagram what you mean? Have you seen the photos of
the brain? Does it tell you where the bullet came from and where it went?
Can you see the two trails of debris exiting the left side of his head?
No, no, no and no. Contrary to you people, I am not qualified.
Let me write this for the 100th. time.
I am not a scientist, nor play one in Usenet, much less on TV. I did NOT
go to MIT, which I consider my adoptive Alma Mater. Worked there, as an
Internet pioneer and co-founder.
My only job here is to build the baseball park.
"If you build it, they will come".
I will be the boy in the cheap seats cheering the best moves *BY BOTH
TEAMS*. May the best team with. Let Science decide. Science never fails to
find The Truth.
- No position
- No theories
- No hypotheses
No, that's untrue. You asked, in the first post, "What was the explanation
for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the limo?"

That's your position, and I have pointed out to you that your claim is
unproven. The original source document says the Harper fragment was found
south of the limo at the time of the head shot. I urge you to look at a
map of Dealey Plaza and determine which direction south is. William Harper
was also located by a researcher (Milicent Cranor?) years later and asked
to mark a map indicating where he found it. He too marked it south of the
limo. Your facts are wrong, your position is wrong. You can ignore the
facts all you want. It doesn't make your theory or your hypothesis or your
position more true.

By pretending the skull fragment was found behind the limo -- an untrue
claim asserted in certain conspiracy books -- you reveal you're getting
your information from those conspiracy books, not from the original source
documents.
Post by ***@gmail.com
What do we want to [dis]prove, then?
Absolutely NOTHING.
Untrue - you're trying to establish a conspiracy, as your questions about
the Harper fragment and the head movement definitely imply. You're also
claiming Sturdivan isn't qualified to render an opinion. But you haven't
(dis)proven that, just asserted it.

You're not fooling anyone by insisting you have no dog in this hunt.

Your dog has left his paw prints all over the place.
Post by ***@gmail.com
What we have is a few questions, all of numerical
nature. Out of respect to The People we demand those questions to be
answered by The Authoritative Entities.
-Ramon The Builder of the Baseball Park
JFK Numbers
ps: Okay, I will address the "random" issue. Imagine that you are really
pissed at your PC, take a gun and shoot it. The official version claims
that in response, the PC will display a tic-tac-toe and a synthesized
voice will greet you. Sturdivan, an inept, totally unqualified to deal
with Forensic Cases that involve Cranium and Cerebrum ballistics claims
that some muscles are stronger.
http://youtu.be/GVo8-1-n078
Number of qualified supporters: ZERO.
- Simulated or real
- Alive or dead
has ever jumped toward the gun. So, do we have a consensus? Should science
study the case? Should simulations track down the Harper's Fragment?
Can we see a show of hands? When did calendars and clocks stop running for
you? According to the Myeristas, in 2003, others say 2013. Any bets on
what will happen in 2023?
Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)
2020-09-08 02:06:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)
Post by ***@gmail.com
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
Random> What are you babbling about?
Can you describe and or diagram what you mean? Have you seen the photos of
the brain? Does it tell you where the bullet came from and where it went?
Can you see the two trails of debris exiting the left side of his head?
No, no, no and no. Contrary to you people, I am not qualified.
Let me write this for the 100th. time.
I am not a scientist, nor play one in Usenet, much less on TV. I did NOT
go to MIT, which I consider my adoptive Alma Mater. Worked there, as an
Internet pioneer and co-founder.
My only job here is to build the baseball park.
"If you build it, they will come".
I will be the boy in the cheap seats cheering the best moves *BY BOTH
TEAMS*. May the best team with. Let Science decide. Science never fails to
find The Truth.
- No position
- No theories
- No hypotheses
No, that's untrue. You asked, in the first post, "What was the explanation
for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the limo?"
That's your position, and I have pointed out to you that your claim is
unproven. The original source document says the Harper fragment was found
south of the limo at the time of the head shot. I urge you to look at a
map of Dealey Plaza and determine which direction south is. William Harper
was also located by a researcher (Milicent Cranor?) years later and asked
to mark a map indicating where he found it. He too marked it south of the
limo. Your facts are wrong, your position is wrong. You can ignore the
facts all you want. It doesn't make your theory or your hypothesis or your
position more true.
By pretending the skull fragment was found behind the limo -- an untrue
claim asserted in certain conspiracy books -- you reveal you're getting
your information from those conspiracy books, not from the original source
documents.
Post by ***@gmail.com
What do we want to [dis]prove, then?
Absolutely NOTHING.
Untrue - you're trying to establish a conspiracy, as your questions about
the Harper fragment and the head movement definitely imply. You're also
claiming Sturdivan isn't qualified to render an opinion. But you haven't
(dis)proven that, just asserted it.
You're not fooling anyone by insisting you have no dog in this hunt.
Your dog has left his paw prints all over the place.
Seven days and no retraction or support coming from Ramon for his claim
that the Harper Fragment was found behind the limo.

It's false, yet he refuses to retract or clarify it.

A fool and his money are soon parted, but a conspiracy theorist and their
mythology? Those go to the grave together.

Hank

Steve Barber
2020-08-18 23:38:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
I was explaining to one of the members of the JFK Numbers team -world
"There are two simulation categories.
(a) Hollywood: If I tell the author that upon impact flower bouquets and a
choir of angels emerged from the victim's cranium and chest, they will do
exactly that.
(b) Mathematics and Physics based, Finite Element Analysis/Computational
Fluid Dynamics (FEA/CFD). (**)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPJIiEREC5GipycH-M6OsSP3
"After impact the force vector was such and such, and the body snapped
here and there".
"Ramon, I don't care how much you paid us (actually you are stinking
cheap, aren't you, Mister Supported-by-The-Kennedys Herrera?), all we can
do is fire the projectile, from any location and angle, weapon of your
choice, bullet of any caliber, hitting any desired spot in the cranium
model with the maximum precision, wind speed and direction, temperature,
barometric pressure, sun position, cloud coverage ...
.. from then on, the Immutable Laws of Physics are strictly followed by
the best software in the world (**).
This is the full collection of head shots so far. It is unique in the
world. As you can see, there has been plenty of progress along the years.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPK8OH2ix3yVUO2fm67yonGN
But -as usual- I digress.
What was the explanation for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the
limo? And its disappearance?
The Random Neurological Damage, too?
-Ramon
JFK Numbers
(c) Utter bullshit, proclaimed by people who have absolutely no clue about
Forensic Cases where Ballistics of Cranium and Cerebrum are involved, or
the minimal required education, such as the Haags (father and son),
"scholar" (RLMAO) Larry "Put Your Photon Torpedo in my Torpedo Bay, Mr.
Spock" Sturdivan, the "scientists" from the Boston University School of
Medicine (who never signed the "definite" study paid with the Koch credit
card), Gerald Posner, Esquire (or his faithful secretary Dale Lyers),
Michael Maden, Vince DiMaio, etc.
http://jfknumbers-forum.org/The_Time_Machine/forensic/boston-university-school-medicine.html
(**) ANSYS, in Explicit Dynamics mode, used to study events of large
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BydXldbRY__vRUtNWTNTQTZSQzg
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs. Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago. Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin. Perhaps you should consider looking at everything before
making posts like the ones above. God knows it would only help you.
John McAdams
2020-08-18 23:51:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
digitized them:

https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Steve Barber
2020-08-19 01:04:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorities by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
The only thing I can point you too, re: Burroughs, is the photograph
taken by one of the news photographers looking east from the underpass,
and an arrow is drawn to the grass east of the manhole cover on the south
side of Elm Street (several feet east of where Walthers, J.W. Foster are
photographed at the manhole cover). On the back of the 8x10 photo,
someone from the Dallas police have inscribed the information on the rear
side of the photograph, indicting where the skull fragment was found.
Since Google groups doesn't allow image files to be posted, I'll have to
send it to you via email, or facebook.
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-19 22:40:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?

Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment

Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
Josiah Thompson, in Six Seconds in Dallas, after citing Cairns, notes that:
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
Loading Image...

That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.

But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.


Loading Image...

Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.

Loading Image...
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?

So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?

Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
John McAdams
2020-08-20 03:19:22 UTC
Permalink
On 19 Aug 2020 22:40:07 -0000, Anthony Marsh
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But the fragment is from parietal bone, as the HSCA determined.
Post by Anthony Marsh
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
Not really. PDF's are so ubiquitous that you should get the free
Abobe reader.
Post by Anthony Marsh
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
The WC didn't mention it.
Post by Anthony Marsh
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Dox is more precise. Angle probably isn't even intended to be drawn
to scale.

.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-20 19:40:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by John McAdams
On 19 Aug 2020 22:40:07 -0000, Anthony Marsh
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But the fragment is from parietal bone, as the HSCA determined.
Post by Anthony Marsh
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
Not really. PDF's are so ubiquitous that you should get the free
Abobe reader.
Post by Anthony Marsh
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
The WC didn't mention it.
You say the WC didn't even mention it? The Harper fragment.
Amd yet you praise the WC sand say the solved the case?
And they just accepted the Rydberg diagram supervised by Dr. Humes?
Even you can't see where the Harper fragment would fit into that!

Loading Image...

Do you accept the Rydberg drawing or do you realize it is a hoax?
Post by John McAdams
Post by Anthony Marsh
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Dox is more precise. Angle probably isn't even intended to be drawn
to scale.
Fair rnough. He made some errors. He was working with what they gave
him. But do you think he got left and right right?
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-20 19:40:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by John McAdams
On 19 Aug 2020 22:40:07 -0000, Anthony Marsh
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But the fragment is from parietal bone, as the HSCA determined.
Post by Anthony Marsh
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
Not really. PDF's are so ubiquitous that you should get the free
Abobe reader.
Post by Anthony Marsh
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
The WC didn't mention it.
Post by Anthony Marsh
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Dox is more precise. Angle probably isn't even intended to be drawn
to scale.
Take a look at the WC exhibit fran by Rdberg.

http://the-puzzle-palace.com/rydberg.gif

Do you see where they placed a bullet hole in the occipital bone?
Do you think there could be a bullet hole only in the SCALP, but not in
the bone below?
KInd of a trick question because there have been cases where a bullet
goes through the scalp and then does not prentrate the skull.
ut do you see how far above the bullet hole they put the massive blowout
of the skull? Who in the WC thought that made any sense?
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
BOZ
2020-08-20 13:31:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
There is no question that the explosion from the bullet impact radiates
matter in all directions. The fine matter can be seen surrounding the
President's head. However, the major direction of this matter is just
forward of the President's head. The major, or large particles which are
actually measurable on the film, and have contiguous boundaries which hold
together during flight, all radiate in a forward direction. ("John Kennedy
Assassination Film Analysis," Itek Corporation, May 2, 1976, Lexington,
Mass., p. 56)
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-21 12:21:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by BOZ
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
There is no question that the explosion from the bullet impact radiates
matter in all directions. The fine matter can be seen surrounding the
Of course there is a question. The bone can not escape unless there is
a hole in the scalp. Look at where the WC put it and where the HSCA put
it. Which do you like better?
Post by BOZ
President's head. However, the major direction of this matter is just
forward of the President's head. The major, or large particles which are
actually measurable on the film, and have contiguous boundaries which hold
together during flight, all radiate in a forward direction. ("John Kennedy
Assassination Film Analysis," Itek Corporation, May 2, 1976, Lexington,
Mass., p. 56)
You can see 2 streaks of debris, including skull fagments exiting the left
side of the head during Zapruder frame 314.
BOZ
2020-08-20 13:31:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Dr. J. Lawrence Angel described the fragment in a memorandum addressed to
the HSCA: "The Harper fragment photographs show it as a roughly
trapezoidal piece, 7 centimeters by 5.5 centimeters in size, coming mainly
from the upper middle third of the right parietal bone."
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-21 12:21:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by BOZ
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
Burroughs.
Can you point me to a source on that? Did he specify the location?
Post by Steve Barber
Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/harper.htm
Was the Fragment Occipital Bone?
Billy Harper, who discovered the piece of bone when he was in Dealey Plaza
on November 23rd taking pictures, took the fragment to his uncle, a Dr.
Jack C. Harper, and Dr. Harper took the bone to Methodist Hospital where
is was examined by Dr. A. B. Cairns, who was chief pathologist. Cairns
opinion was that "the bone specimen looked like it came from the occipital
region of the skull." Conspiracy interpretation of source of Harper
fragment
Conspiracy books ever since have quoted Cairns, and used his assessment
as evidence of a frontal shot exiting the rear of the head. Author
So, where do you think it came from?
The diagram you show on your web site shows it in the back of the head.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/images/groden_harper.jpg
That might suggest that a bullet from the front blew it out of the back
of his head.
But you show the Dox diagram made under the supervision of Dr. Michael
baden which shows it blown out of the TOP of the head by a bullet from
behind.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dox2big.jpg
Dr. Lawrence Angle ahows it more forward in the skull, which might mean
it was bl0own out by a bullet from in front or from the right.
http://the-puzzle-palace.com/Angel-AP.jpg
Post by John McAdams
Post by Steve Barber
Perhaps you should read the
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin.
The Wisconsin Historical Society. And a certain Wisconsin resident
https://jfkassassination.net/pdf/lane_interviews/brehm.pdf
Excellent, but we can't display PDFs here. Can you convert it to a rich
text file?
So, where do you think the Harper fragment was in the skull?
Do you agree that the WC got it wrong?
Then we can quibble about which drawing is better, Dox or Angel.
Post by John McAdams
.John
-----------------------
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm
Dr. J. Lawrence Angel described the fragment in a memorandum addressed to
the HSCA: "The Harper fragment photographs show it as a roughly
trapezoidal piece, 7 centimeters by 5.5 centimeters in size, coming mainly
from the upper middle third of the right parietal bone."
Close enough for government work. Did you see his diagram that I
uploaded?
Anthony Marsh
2020-08-19 22:40:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Barber
Post by ***@gmail.com
Pristine Subject Header: "... and the Harper Fragment, was it also due to
the random neurological damage?"
I was explaining to one of the members of the JFK Numbers team -world
"There are two simulation categories.
(a) Hollywood: If I tell the author that upon impact flower bouquets and a
choir of angels emerged from the victim's cranium and chest, they will do
exactly that.
(b) Mathematics and Physics based, Finite Element Analysis/Computational
Fluid Dynamics (FEA/CFD). (**)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPJIiEREC5GipycH-M6OsSP3
"After impact the force vector was such and such, and the body snapped
here and there".
"Ramon, I don't care how much you paid us (actually you are stinking
cheap, aren't you, Mister Supported-by-The-Kennedys Herrera?), all we can
do is fire the projectile, from any location and angle, weapon of your
choice, bullet of any caliber, hitting any desired spot in the cranium
model with the maximum precision, wind speed and direction, temperature,
barometric pressure, sun position, cloud coverage ...
.. from then on, the Immutable Laws of Physics are strictly followed by
the best software in the world (**).
This is the full collection of head shots so far. It is unique in the
world. As you can see, there has been plenty of progress along the years.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLof8jFzqbDPK8OH2ix3yVUO2fm67yonGN
But -as usual- I digress.
What was the explanation for the Harper Fragment landing meters behind the
limo? And its disappearance?
The Random Neurological Damage, too?
-Ramon
JFK Numbers
(c) Utter bullshit, proclaimed by people who have absolutely no clue about
Forensic Cases where Ballistics of Cranium and Cerebrum are involved, or
the minimal required education, such as the Haags (father and son),
"scholar" (RLMAO) Larry "Put Your Photon Torpedo in my Torpedo Bay, Mr.
Spock" Sturdivan, the "scientists" from the Boston University School of
Medicine (who never signed the "definite" study paid with the Koch credit
card), Gerald Posner, Esquire (or his faithful secretary Dale Lyers),
Michael Maden, Vince DiMaio, etc.
http://jfknumbers-forum.org/The_Time_Machine/forensic/boston-university-school-medicine.html
(**) ANSYS, in Explicit Dynamics mode, used to study events of large
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BydXldbRY__vRUtNWTNTQTZSQzg
People like you cannot be taken seriously. Calling people names by
changing a letter within their name to try to make a point confirms what I
said. This is why so few people get into commenting on your posts. I'll
tell you this much. The Harper fragment didn't "land behind the limo".
It landed several yards AHEAD of the limousine, along with other
fragments--one of which was turned over to the authorites by a David
OK, but does that answer his question?
Do you agree with HSCA or Dr. Angle about how the Harper fragment fits
into the skull? Do you have your own diagram? It doesn't bother you at
all that the WC didn't even try to explian it?
Post by Steve Barber
Burroughs. Billy Harper confirmed this when he drew the location on a map
sent to him by Milcent Cranor years ago. Perhaps you should read the
OMG,you are endorsing work not done by the WC!
Post by Steve Barber
entire interview of Charles Brehm by Mark Lane, rather than rely on the
ridiculous stuff Lane put in his book, where he misquoted Brehm. The
entire interview is documented on paper that were donated to a college in
Wisconsin. Perhaps you should consider looking at everything before
making posts like the ones above. God knows it would only help you.
Why didn't you quote it for him?
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