Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechDON'T GIVE ME THAT COVERUP CRAP! The photo of the BOH that we have is
perfectly valid and clear for the purpose of seeing a bullet hole. But
there is none there. The photo shows the areas where the pathologists
said the bullet hole was located, but there's nothing there. And you
won't want to hear it, but the photo of the BOH is also very WRONG, since
there were over 39 eyewitnesses that there was a 'large hole' in the BOH,
right where the photo shows hair and no hole. Not only do the photos show
falseness in the reporting, but they prove they were altered as well. If
the medical examiners saw those photos, then there's no doubt they got the
wrong conclusions as to the cause of death. Naturally, the LNs reading
this will ignore completely the photographic proof just shown.
So you think your amateurish opinion based on looking at one photo trumps
the findings of the 3 pathologists who had the body in front of them as
well as teams of highly qualified review panels who saw so many more
photos as well as x-rays.
WRONG as usual! So you think your amateur opinion of my flat statement
of what I saw is somehow more right?
I know it is.
Post by mainframetechThen why didn't you take the
challenge when I first made it, to point out the bullet hole location
using the information from the pathologists as to the location of the
bullet hole?
I'm not dumb enough to think by looking at one photo that I can make a
better judgement about an entry wound in JFK's head than the original
pathologists who saw the body and the review panels who saw so many more
and better quality photos than I have.
LOL! Not willing to take the challenge when you're so sure that a
bullet struck the BOH?
I could take a cue from you and pretend to see a bullet hole and then
declare that it is obvious but why would I do that? People far more
qualified than me who have determined without a doubt that a bullet
entered the back of JFK's head. I believe the red spot is the hole in the
scalp and my guess is that it does not line up with the hole in the skull.
Why would I want to substitute my guess for the unanimous verdict of every
qualified person who has seen far more and better evidence than I have.
Post by mainframetechWow! No belief in your own WCR! More proof for
me that the WCR is a tired old phony and outmoded. So you try to lay off
the blame on the photo quality, which is just fine for the purpose of
seeing a bullet hole, and you've blamed your lack of courage to look for a
bullet hole on the fact that it's only one photo!
I don't have to blame anything. I know how to weigh evidence and I know
the opinions of those who are more qualified than I am and have seen far
more than I have far outweighs any opinion I have. It also outweighs any
opinion you have but since you are so bad at weighing evidence, you can't
figure that out.
Post by mainframetechFailed excuses! Your
lack of courage means that there is NO bullet hole there in that photo,
and we both know the reason. There was no bullet hole in the BOH, and the
photo is a phony in either case. One more for the CT scorecard.
Whatever you may think about my lack of courage it doesn't erase the
bullet hole that every qualified medical examiner determined was there and
was a wound of entry.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechWas it because you couldn't see any bullet hole?
I don't need to see the bullet hole. Extremely qualified people who saw
many more and better photos as well as x-rays saw it. They don't need me
to confirm their findings.
Ah! Still blaming the photo quality.
If you were any good at weighing evidence, you would know the quality of
the photos online aren't nearly as good as the originals which the review
panels have seen.
Post by mainframetechBut you haven't even looked at
the photo so how would you know the quality is bad? I think the quality
is just fine to see a bullet hole, if there was one there.
Who told you I hadn't looked at the photo? Oh, that's right. The same way
you have come by most of your knowledge. You just assumed it.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechI never
heard you comment after looking, or did you avoid looking too so you could
have 'plausible denial'? It doesn't take experts to see that there is no
bullet hole in the BOH of that photo, and one photo is all that's needed
to tell that there's no bullet hole.
Amazing how you think by looking at one photo your opinion should trump
that of the original pathology team and all the review panels. Is there no
end to your silliness. Apparently not.
Well, you might want to try and explain why no one can se a bullet
hole right where the pathologists said there was supposed to be one.
Who said no one can see a bullet hole. There is a red spot in the photo
and I and many others believe that is the bullet hole. I can't be certain
that is the bullet hole because I'm not qualified to make such judgements
and I have seen only that one photo. People who are qualified and have
seen so much more have determined there is an entry wound in the BOH and
that is good enough for me. Obviously nothing would be good enough for
you.
Post by mainframetechBut
of course, you don't want to get too deep into this, because there is only
one final answer.
Yes there is. Oswald did it.
How would you know?
Post by mainframetechand the quality of the photo is just
fine for seeing bullet holes.
It's fine for imagining you see bullet holes.
Post by mainframetechOne photo of the right area is all that is
needed to determine if there is a bullet hole there or not.
There is a bullet hole in the BOH and no bullet hole in the forehead.
That's what all the knowledgeable people have said. Then we have your
opinion.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechAs well, you haven't found any explanation for there to be hair all
over the BOH, when over 39 eyewitnesses said they saw a 'large hole'
there. Many of them were medically trained and knew what they were
describing.
You are the one who needs to explain that conundrum. You are the one who
claims there was a blowout in the BOH. I know better.
Ah! That means that you have some explanation for why over 39
eyewitnesses all corroborated each other that the 'large hole' was there.
There was a large hole that extended into occipital bone but was chiefly
parietal.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogI don't know whether they red spot is the bullet
hole or not.
I'm having a hard time believing that you fell for that, since it was
"Humes’ comments regarding the supposed higher wound during his
HSCA testimony are particularly telling. After several failed attempts to
get both Humes and Boswell to agree the inshoot was high, the
HSCA’s Charles Petty, MD had another go with Humes, this time
concerning the possibility a red spot in the autopsy photos visible at the
top of JFK’s otherwise pristine rear scalp was the inshoot. Gazing
together at the photograph showing the all but unblemished rear of
“I don’t know what that [red spot] is. No. 1, I can assure
you that as we reflected the scalp to get to this point, there was no
defect corresponding to this in the skull at any point. I don’t
know what that is. It could be to me clotted blood. I don’t, I
just don’t know what it is, but it certainly was not any wound of
entrance.”
From: https://www.history-matters.com/essays/jfkmed/How5Investigations/How5InvestigationsGotItWrong_6.htm
As I said, I don't know whether that red spot is the bullet hole. If it
isn't, it is elsewhere. I'm not going to dismiss the unanimous opinion of
every medical examiner who saw so much more evidence than I have just
because I don't see an obvious bullet hole. Why would you do so?
"obvious bullet hole"? Then why can't it be seen? The variations
given by the pathologists for locations are all within the confines of the
photo in question, so why would the bullet hole not be there? The photo
quality is very good so that's not an excuse. I think you've just proved
that there is no bullet hole in the BOH.
You can carry on all you want. Your opinion doesn't stack up against what
knowledgeable people have concluded. You are not competent to render such
judgements and you have seen a fraction of the evidence.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogWhat I do know is that at scalp had been pulled away from the
skull and if it was pulled back up for that picture, it may not have lined
up with the hole in the scalp making the hole harder to see. It's also
possible the entry wound is hidden under the hair. In any case, it would
be very silly of me to think with my complete lack of training in forensic
medicine that I could look at one photo and make a better determination
than the three pathologists who conducted the autopsy and teams of the
best medical examiners in the country who got to see far more and better
quality photos and x-rays than I have. What kind of moron would do
something like that?
The moron would be the one that thought that it would have to take an
expert to determine if there was a bullet-sized hole in the BOH. Anyone
can see plainly that there is no such thing.
So you think by looking at one photo you can make a better judgement than
the review panels who saw so much more. Absurd.
What's absurd is your attempt to pretend that the photo can't show a
simple bullet hole.
It probably does but I can't be certain that red spot is the bullet hole
the review panels saw or if the bullet hole showed up elsewhere in the
other photos they looked at. It is possible the entry wound could be
covered by JFK's hair. That's why I'm not dumb enough to think I can look
at one photo and think I can make a better determination than the review
panels. Apparently that isn't a problem for you.
Post by mainframetechThis is not rocket science. It's a simple hole in
the BOH in a photo. So where is it?
Where the review panels said. In the BOH.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogYou are making a big deal about not being able to see a small entry wound
in the BOH. Apparently it doesn't bother you that the large blowout in the
BOH that you claim was there doesn't show up in that photo either. Got any
explanation for that?
Of course! I've addressed that recently. You probably missed it,
which you tend to do. I've pointed out that the photo of the BOH was
altered, and there is no doubt about it.
Oh, so you are using a altered photo to prove there was no entry wound in
the BOH. Brilliant work, Sherlock. Did the people who altered the photo to
hide the big hole forget to alter it to show a little hole?
Sounds like you figured it out all by yourself! Excellent work
Sherlock! If the photo was legitimate, then there is NO hole in the BOH.
But if the photo is altered, then we're dealing with altered evidence,
which means the possibility that the panels were shown the phony photos so
that they would come to the wrong conclusion as to the cause of death. A
bullet from above and behind.
Then there is the correct explanation. You just don't know what you are
talking about.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechSworn testimony says there was a
'large hole' there, and yet the photo shows what the original government
report told about, which was no large hole in the BOH. Whoever altered
the autopsy photos forgot to put in the bullet hole,
I suggested that facetiously before I read your comment in which you
stated that seriously. Amazing these klutzes who masterminded this
conspiracy did so many dumb things yet still pulled it off and have gotten
away with it all these years. They couldn't hire competent gunmen. They
didn't give them decent ammo. They put an army of shooters in Dealey Plaza
and then tried to blame one man. They planted a bullet at Parkland but put
it on the wrong gurney. They sent a guy to kill Oswald but he didn't get
there at the announced time of the transfer. They played a ridiculous game
of musical caskets at Bethesda instead of just having the pathologists
falsify the report. You claim they falsified the BOH photo but forgot to
put in an entrance wound. They forgot to alter the photo that shows a
bullet hole in the forehead/temple. All this and about a dozen other
things that I've forgotten about. You have to believe they made all these
mistakes and yet still got away with the crime of the century. It is truly
amazing the things you are willing to convince yourself of to fool
yourself into believing in a non-existent conspiracy.
You seem to have forgotten something else. That phony story I've told
you all about is supported by 40% of the US population,
Since most people who don't know the most rudimentary facts of the
assassination that is pretty much irrelevant.
Post by mainframetechand some folks
have kept arguing for the phony story for 50 years and more. That means
the true story has less traction and is an uphill battle for belief of the
evidence. In effect, YOU are the reason that all the info you've listed
above is hard for some people to believe is because you go around arguing
for the tired old WCR.
99.999999% of the people in this country aren't even aware of what I
believe about the assassination. My arguments haven't moved the needle of
public opinion.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechbut they didn't
forget to tell Ida Dox to put it in to her drawing of the original photo.
Talk about hilarious! The drawing has a bullet hole, and the photo it
came from has nothing! LOL!
Oh, so they were still engineering the cover up when Ida Dox produced the
drawings for the HSCA. They had the HSCA continue with the cover up but
forgot to tell them to conclude that there was only one shooter. What
morons.
The evidence that was left to look at would suggest only one 'lone
nut' killer, so what else could they conclude?
That there was no conspiracy which would have been the correct answer.
Post by mainframetechhttp://i318.photobucket.com/albums/mm433/JFKAUTOPSYPHOTOS/JFKcolor_boh_autopsy_photo.jpg
Post by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechGo ahead, look for the bullet entry! When you can't find it, you'll
have to call Lipsey a liar.
And don't forget his mismatch in his HSCA statement and his video.
More lies.
There were no lies in either of the two statements. They are compatible.
Both were interviews and the questions were different so naturally the
answers would be different.
Oh, get away! His 2 statements did not agree, and it is simple to
see the difference. And it's not due to different questions.
Why would you expect him to give the same answers to different questions?
Depends on the questions.
Yes it does so I ask you again. Why would you expect the same answers to
different questions.
Depends on the questions. It's very possible to ask different
questions to get to the same truth. Think it through.
Obviously you haven't or you wouldn't have made a such a silly argument.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechNow here's a final statement from Lipsey, since you're so determined to
"The ceremonial troop in Washington had been arranged to meet the body at
Andrews. Put it in a hearse. We had a decoy hearse because we knew there
was a mob waiting at Bethesda Naval Hospital. So we got in a couple of
these helicopters with our honor guard when they left and flew over to the
hospital to get there before they did. And when they came in, one of the
hearses went right up to the front door. All of the crowd, of course,
rushed over there. The one with the body in it went around to the back
where the morgue was and we unloaded it. We met them in the back and
unloaded it right there to avoid the news media and the crowd and
everything else."
From: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/med_testimony/Lipsey_1-18-78/HSCA-Lipsey.htm
And while Lipsey said the casket went by road, there was no choice that
it went by helicopter because it got to the morgue 42 minutes BEFORE the
empty Bronze casket. Lipsey has clearly said there were 2 ambulances, one
was 'decoy', and one went to the back door with the body, and the other
went to the main entrance.
I've showed you the time line that would have made it impossible for your
imaginary shipping casket to get to Bethesda 42 minute before the bronze
casket. For one it's only a 40 minute drive from Andrews to Bethesda and
that is if you don't have a police escort. The ambulance had a huge head
start on any shipping casket that would have been unloaded from AF1 after
all the cameras and witnesses had left the area. Even if the shipping
casket had been sent to Bethesda by teleportation, it could not have
arrived 42 minutes before the bronze casket.
I wonder about you. You get sworn testimony and corroboration that
there were 2 caskets and they arrived at different times, and you still
try to pretend that the evidence didn't happen! That's weird! You base
your imaginary story on guesses as to road conditions, and speed of
driving, when you have flat statements of what had transpired in reality.
And of course, you've left out the time spent at the main entrance while
the family got out of the ambulance.
There is no sworn testimony by anyone that two caskets arrived. Everybody
who weighed in described one casket.
WRONG!
If I am wrong you should be able to point to a witness that said two
caskets arrived at different times. You still can't.
I have done so, and you ignored the proof.
No you haven't. All the witnesses you cited only said they saw one casket
arrive. Name ONE person who said he saw two.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechAnd you've been given an answer to that many times. Don't
begin to pretend that you never heard the answer.
You've never cited a single witness who said they saw two caskets arrive
and you still can't.
Post by mainframetechDennis David gave his
statement that he helped to bring in the SHIPPING casket, and then at
least a half hour later he saw the motorcade and ambulance that Jackie was
in with the Bronze casket arrive at the main entrance of the hospital.
The family came in and was taken by elevator to the 17th floor to the VIP
suite.
He saw the family dropped off at the front but didn't say he saw another
casket.
Oh, I see. You're playing another hopeful game. You hope that it's no
proof unless a witness actually SAYS that he saw 2 caskets.
Yes, that is the point. If everybody saw only one casket, even if they
disagreed as to the type of casket and the time it arrived, there is no
proof that more than one casket arrived. The reason that is true is that
after 3 decades, witnesses often get details wrong, especially when
recounting events that happened 3 decades earlier. You treat those 3
decade old memories as if they are absolute proof. That is because you are
really, really bad at weighing evidence. You can't figure out what
evidence is reliable and what is dubious.
Post by mainframetechWell, in the
normal course, that may not happen, but we have minds and therefore can
deduce from available info what occurred.
Your deductions really suck.
Post by mainframetechFact, we know we saw the Bronze casket come down from AF1 and it went
into a hearse/ambulance with the family and started off for Bethesda.
Yes, we have a film record of that.
Post by mainframetechWe
know that Dennis David was assigned the detail to help get the SHIPPING
casket into the morgue and place the body on the table #1. Sworn
testimony and documents prove that.
We don't know that the casket Dennis David helped carry into the morgue
was a shipping casket because he told us that 3 decades later and could
have been wrong about that. You are on other hand treat that 3 decade old
memory as if it were a proven fact.
Post by mainframetechThen Dennis David says that he went out front to the lobby area after
a half hour, and he saw the hearse/ambulance arrive at the main entrance
and unload family from it. Mind you, the Shipping casket has been at the
morgue for at least a half hour. We know that was the ambulance with the
Bronze casket is in the ambulance at the main entrance because Jackie got
out of it. So now we have absolute proof that there were 2 caskets and
David saw them arrive.
This it the whole fallacy of your approach. You treat someone's 3 decade
old memory as if it is absolute proof. You refuse to consider that a
witness could be wrong about the type of casket he saw arrive with JFK's
body.
Post by mainframetechThe ambulance at the main entrance went around the
back to the morgue, and there is your second arrival.
You have not established that it was a separate casket. We have other
witnesses, specifically Sibert and O'Neill who said JFK's body was in the
bronze casket when it arrived at the morgue. To explain away that
inconvenient fact, you present an even more ridiculous scenario that they
put JFK's body back into the bronze casket and sent it back out to be
redelivered to the loading dock. Try telling that to 100 people and I
would bet at least 99 would bust a gut laughing at you.
Post by mainframetechIf you try to
pretend that it was the same arrival as the SHIPING casket, than you've
lost touch will reality.
You're one to talk.
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechSo you've got the same person seeing separate casket arrivals with
time in between.
Point to where he said he saw a second casket. Can't do it? Didn't think
so.
WRONG! Don't need to have him say he saw two caskets.
Of course you don't. You can just assume he did.
Post by mainframetechYou're
making up a phony situation so you can then pick at it, but it won't help
you. What he stated that he saw was plenty good for deducing there were 2
separate caskets. And all your picking at it won't change it.
You think this whole tale of the body being switched back and forth from
one casket to another and then making multiple arrivals at the loading
dock makes more sense than some witnesses simply got some details wrong in
trying to remember something that happened 3 decades earlier. How many
events from 30 years ago could you perfectly remember in every detail?
Post by mainframetechPost by bigdogPost by mainframetechHe brought in the SHIPPING casket at 6:35pm, and after
at least a half hour (by his own statement) he saw the ambulance with the
Bronze casket from AF1 stop at the main entrance.
Quote him saying he saw a bronze casket in addition to the shipping
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=708#relPageId=3&tab=page
He does not say he saw a bronze casket come out of the Navy ambulance. He
saw one casket. Period. You have no one who saw two caskets.
OK. You're intentionally trying to make a mess out of simple evidence.
And your misunderstanding sounds more faked than real, so I'm tired of
this repetitive talk. You have all relevant info, so I'm outa here.
Since you can't cite even one witness who said he saw two different
caskets arrive, that is probably your best move.