Discussion:
What was causing Oswald's nervousness at the Soviet Embassy?
(too old to reply)
Steve M. Galbraith
2021-03-06 20:56:55 UTC
Permalink
The three Soviet Embassy officials/KGB officers who met Oswald when he
went to Mexico City to go to Cuba said he was acting "nervously" and
"shaking" at the time. Recall that the Cubans (Duran) told Oswald she
needed to see his Soviet visa before she would give him (on the spot) a
transit visa to go to Cuba. So he visited the Soviet embassy twice to get
one.

Here is how they described him (this is from the Frontline special "Who
was Lee Harvey Oswald?"):

FRONTLINE NARRATOR: At the Soviet embassy, he [i.e., Oswald] met with
three consular officials. In fact, all three were KGB officers working
under diplomatic cover. In this, their first interview, they recall that
Oswald's hands were shaking and his behavior was erratic.

OLEG NECHIPORENKO, KGB: [through interpreter] We all thought the man had
an unstable nervous system. He was extremely agitated.

VALERY KOSTIKOV, KGB: [through interpreter] During our talk, Oswald kept
feeling in his pockets, taking out all sorts of papers. Then he took out a
gun and put it in front of him. I sat opposite him. I took the gun away
and put it on Pavel's desk.

Pavel Antonovich asked him, "Why did you come here with a gun? What do you
need a gun for?" He said, "I'm afraid of the FBI. I'm being persecuted. I
need a gun to protect myself, for my personal safety." That's what he
said."

Here is the video; go to the 1:100 mark to see the above:
https://www.pbs.org/video/frontline-who-was-lee-harvey-oswald/

Okay, so he's acting in a desperate manner in order to get the visa. But
the shaking and nervousness were caused by? Oswald was known to be
demanding but he was also usually cool and in command.
Bud
2021-03-07 17:34:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
The three Soviet Embassy officials/KGB officers who met Oswald when he
went to Mexico City to go to Cuba said he was acting "nervously" and
"shaking" at the time. Recall that the Cubans (Duran) told Oswald she
needed to see his Soviet visa before she would give him (on the spot) a
transit visa to go to Cuba. So he visited the Soviet embassy twice to get
one.
Here is how they described him (this is from the Frontline special "Who
FRONTLINE NARRATOR: At the Soviet embassy, he [i.e., Oswald] met with
three consular officials. In fact, all three were KGB officers working
under diplomatic cover. In this, their first interview, they recall that
Oswald's hands were shaking and his behavior was erratic.
OLEG NECHIPORENKO, KGB: [through interpreter] We all thought the man had
an unstable nervous system. He was extremely agitated.
VALERY KOSTIKOV, KGB: [through interpreter] During our talk, Oswald kept
feeling in his pockets, taking out all sorts of papers. Then he took out a
gun and put it in front of him. I sat opposite him. I took the gun away
and put it on Pavel's desk.
Pavel Antonovich asked him, "Why did you come here with a gun? What do you
need a gun for?" He said, "I'm afraid of the FBI. I'm being persecuted. I
need a gun to protect myself, for my personal safety." That's what he
said."
This is doubly weird, since Hosty hadn`t even approached Marina or the
Paines until after LHO returned from Mexico City.
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
https://www.pbs.org/video/frontline-who-was-lee-harvey-oswald/
Okay, so he's acting in a desperate manner in order to get the visa. But
the shaking and nervousness were caused by? Oswald was known to be
demanding but he was also usually cool and in command.
Yes, seems out of character. He didn`t look nervous at all in custody
for killing the President. Went for his gun when surrounded by police, one
with a shotgun. Cool as a cucumber.
Steve M. Galbraith
2021-03-07 21:43:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bud
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
The three Soviet Embassy officials/KGB officers who met Oswald when he
went to Mexico City to go to Cuba said he was acting "nervously" and
"shaking" at the time. Recall that the Cubans (Duran) told Oswald she
needed to see his Soviet visa before she would give him (on the spot) a
transit visa to go to Cuba. So he visited the Soviet embassy twice to get
one.
Here is how they described him (this is from the Frontline special "Who
FRONTLINE NARRATOR: At the Soviet embassy, he [i.e., Oswald] met with
three consular officials. In fact, all three were KGB officers working
under diplomatic cover. In this, their first interview, they recall that
Oswald's hands were shaking and his behavior was erratic.
OLEG NECHIPORENKO, KGB: [through interpreter] We all thought the man had
an unstable nervous system. He was extremely agitated.
VALERY KOSTIKOV, KGB: [through interpreter] During our talk, Oswald kept
feeling in his pockets, taking out all sorts of papers. Then he took out a
gun and put it in front of him. I sat opposite him. I took the gun away
and put it on Pavel's desk.
Pavel Antonovich asked him, "Why did you come here with a gun? What do you
need a gun for?" He said, "I'm afraid of the FBI. I'm being persecuted. I
need a gun to protect myself, for my personal safety." That's what he
said."
This is doubly weird, since Hosty hadn`t even approached Marina or the
Paines until after LHO returned from Mexico City.
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
https://www.pbs.org/video/frontline-who-was-lee-harvey-oswald/
Okay, so he's acting in a desperate manner in order to get the visa. But
the shaking and nervousness were caused by? Oswald was known to be
demanding but he was also usually cool and in command.
Yes, seems out of character. He didn`t look nervous at all in custody
for killing the President. Went for his gun when surrounded by police, one
with a shotgun. Cool as a cucumber.
It's odd because he was known for being in control and cool in other
situations. I do think he believed that the FBI was in part the cause for
him getting fired from jobs (he was very upset at losing that photography
job); or not getting good ones. This was, as you said, before the
Hosty/Marina matter where he came to believe that she was being harassed.

As I wrote, okay so he's trying to plead to the Soviets for the visa and
play the political prisoner card. But the shaking and nervousness is
really out of sorts for him. I would guess he realized, or was beginning
to, that all of his dreams of going to Cuba - which was his last option -
were disappearing. Everything, all of his plans that summer agitating for
Castro and creating a pro-Cuba resume, were collapsing around him and he
was having a sort of nervous breakdown.
John Corbett
2021-03-07 21:43:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bud
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
The three Soviet Embassy officials/KGB officers who met Oswald when he
went to Mexico City to go to Cuba said he was acting "nervously" and
"shaking" at the time. Recall that the Cubans (Duran) told Oswald she
needed to see his Soviet visa before she would give him (on the spot) a
transit visa to go to Cuba. So he visited the Soviet embassy twice to get
one.
Here is how they described him (this is from the Frontline special "Who
FRONTLINE NARRATOR: At the Soviet embassy, he [i.e., Oswald] met with
three consular officials. In fact, all three were KGB officers working
under diplomatic cover. In this, their first interview, they recall that
Oswald's hands were shaking and his behavior was erratic.
OLEG NECHIPORENKO, KGB: [through interpreter] We all thought the man had
an unstable nervous system. He was extremely agitated.
VALERY KOSTIKOV, KGB: [through interpreter] During our talk, Oswald kept
feeling in his pockets, taking out all sorts of papers. Then he took out a
gun and put it in front of him. I sat opposite him. I took the gun away
and put it on Pavel's desk.
Pavel Antonovich asked him, "Why did you come here with a gun? What do you
need a gun for?" He said, "I'm afraid of the FBI. I'm being persecuted. I
need a gun to protect myself, for my personal safety." That's what he
said."
This is doubly weird, since Hosty hadn`t even approached Marina or the
Paines until after LHO returned from Mexico City.
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
https://www.pbs.org/video/frontline-who-was-lee-harvey-oswald/
Okay, so he's acting in a desperate manner in order to get the visa. But
the shaking and nervousness were caused by? Oswald was known to be
demanding but he was also usually cool and in command.
Yes, seems out of character. He didn`t look nervous at all in custody
for killing the President. Went for his gun when surrounded by police, one
with a shotgun. Cool as a cucumber.
I think after killing JFK he had pretty much accepted his fate. He was
going to die one way or another, whether it be in a shootout with police
or in the Texas electric chair. I don't think he cared one way or another.
He probably figured it would be the latter after being taken into custody,
not figuring on Jack Ruby to enter the picture. Had it not been for Ruby,
there's a very good possibility Oswald would have been spared execution
when the SCOTUS vacated all existing death sentences in 1971.
W. Tracy Parnell
2021-03-08 03:30:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Corbett
Post by Bud
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
The three Soviet Embassy officials/KGB officers who met Oswald when he
went to Mexico City to go to Cuba said he was acting "nervously" and
"shaking" at the time. Recall that the Cubans (Duran) told Oswald she
needed to see his Soviet visa before she would give him (on the spot) a
transit visa to go to Cuba. So he visited the Soviet embassy twice to get
one.
Here is how they described him (this is from the Frontline special "Who
FRONTLINE NARRATOR: At the Soviet embassy, he [i.e., Oswald] met with
three consular officials. In fact, all three were KGB officers working
under diplomatic cover. In this, their first interview, they recall that
Oswald's hands were shaking and his behavior was erratic.
OLEG NECHIPORENKO, KGB: [through interpreter] We all thought the man had
an unstable nervous system. He was extremely agitated.
VALERY KOSTIKOV, KGB: [through interpreter] During our talk, Oswald kept
feeling in his pockets, taking out all sorts of papers. Then he took out a
gun and put it in front of him. I sat opposite him. I took the gun away
and put it on Pavel's desk.
Pavel Antonovich asked him, "Why did you come here with a gun? What do you
need a gun for?" He said, "I'm afraid of the FBI. I'm being persecuted. I
need a gun to protect myself, for my personal safety." That's what he
said."
This is doubly weird, since Hosty hadn`t even approached Marina or the
Paines until after LHO returned from Mexico City.
Post by Steve M. Galbraith
https://www.pbs.org/video/frontline-who-was-lee-harvey-oswald/
Okay, so he's acting in a desperate manner in order to get the visa. But
the shaking and nervousness were caused by? Oswald was known to be
demanding but he was also usually cool and in command.
Yes, seems out of character. He didn`t look nervous at all in custody
for killing the President. Went for his gun when surrounded by police, one
with a shotgun. Cool as a cucumber.
I think after killing JFK he had pretty much accepted his fate. He was
going to die one way or another, whether it be in a shootout with police
or in the Texas electric chair. I don't think he cared one way or another.
He probably figured it would be the latter after being taken into custody,
not figuring on Jack Ruby to enter the picture. Had it not been for Ruby,
there's a very good possibility Oswald would have been spared execution
when the SCOTUS vacated all existing death sentences in 1971.
Nechiporenko's Oswald Revolver Hoax

(An excerpt from an as yet unpublished work by John Loken follows on
Nechiporenko's 1993 book "Passport to Assassination," with apologies for
its terseness. He hopes you will take it into your consideration)

"Unfortunately for Nechiporenko, his Oswald revolver scenario requires the
reader to believe that: 1) Oswald, after visiting the Mexican Consulate in
New Orleans on September 17 to apply for a visitor’s visa, where
he was given instruction forms that included strict warnings against
bringing firearms into Mexico, nevertheless brought his revolver with him
over the border just a week later, without declaring it, thus risking
arrest, jail, and the end of his Cuban visa dream if searched and caught;
2) that Oswald was deathly afraid of the FBI possibly killing him in
September 1963, though he was actually of very minor interest to them at
the time, and that he then, in such fear of them, demonstrably told
several fellow bus passengers on the way to Mexico City, and in a very
casual manner, that he was going to fly to Cuba and visit Fidel Castro
because it was illegal to do so from the U.S.; 3) that Oswald then entered
the Soviet Embassy compound in Mexico City that Saturday, September 28,
when it was closed, carrying his loaded revolver on him, and was not
searched (frisked / patted down) by any Soviet guards, nor did he worry
beforehand about being searched by any Soviet guards; 4) that Oswald then,
in front of Soviet consular officials (who were also KGB agents), sobbed
for many long minutes out of fear of the FBI, showing himself to be
mentally unstable and even hysterical, though he had never sobbed in
public before but only a few times privately in the presence of his wife
Marina; 5) that Oswald told the Soviets that the FBI had harassed his wife
and questioned his neighbor, though those events did not occur until more
than a month later in Dallas in early November 1963; 6) that Oswald then
pulled out his loaded revolver in front of two or three consular officials
(KGB agents) and set it on a table such that one of the agents
conveniently took it away and safely removed its bullet cartridges; 7)
that Oswald, when he then left the Soviet Embassy compound after
additional minutes of maudlin sobbing, picked his revolver up and was even
given back his bullets by one of the KGB men, which would have risked his
going berserk outside on the streets, which could have become a major
international incident if anyone were killed; 8) that Oswald then went
directly to the Cuban Embassy just two blocks away, which was also closed
that Saturday, presumably still carrying his revolver with him since his
hotel was three miles away, and was not searched by any Cuban guard upon
his entry, nor did he worry beforehand about being searched before
entering with the revolver; and, finally, 9) that Oswald returned to the
U.S. with his revolver, crossing the Mexico-U.S. border at Laredo without
being searched and without even fearing that he would be searched, which
would have resulted in his arrest, detention in jail, and surely even
worse legal problems, if he were caught transporting an undeclared firearm
across the border into the U.S. In sum, what we really have here is the
case of "Nechiporenko's Oswald Revolver Hoax," orchestrated by
Nechiporenko 30 years after the fact with the acquiescence of a former KGB
colleague or two for the purpose of their profiting greatly off the sale
of his (thereby sensational) Oswald book and also for the purpose of
discrediting the FBI, a U.S. domestic law enforcement agency (which was
infinitely less brutal in its methods than was the KGB itself).

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