Post by firstname.lastname@example.org Post by Mark Post by email@example.com Post by Mark Post by firstname.lastname@example.org Post by slats Post by Robert Reynolds
Parkland has a page on the role it played in the the JFK assassination
Documents include the letter you found
/Hospital-Highlights-12-9-63.pdf) and a longer article from a special
edition of Hospital Highlights
The second reference clarifies that JFK was logged into Parkland at
12:38, so this is not necessarily the very instant JFK arrived at
VB also cites Kellerman's testimony at 2 H 80. Kellerman called Gerald
Behn after leaving trauma room one. They both marked down the time,
with Kellerman marking 12:38 and Behn 12:41. Regardless of which was
correct, according to Kellerman's testimony this phone call was three
to five minutes after they arrived at Parkland.
I doubt Kellerman or anyone else took the time to look at their watch once
the limo stopped at Parkland. They had bigger things to worry about. The
better question is why two gurneys weren't waiting for the victims. After
all, they DID call ahead.
The DPD radio dispatcher was immediately told by Chief Curry to notify
Parkland, probably at about 12:31. But, as I recall, one of the doctors at
the hospital got the word that the president was being brought in, and JFK
was already in by the time he got to the trauma room. Perhaps Parkland was
not notified in a timely fashion.
Or Parkland was and the personnel involved didn't communicate with each
other. Slats are you saying DPD Dispatch didn't call Parkland because they
were involved in a conspiracy? Or Parkland employees got the call but
didn't have a stretcher outside in order to prevent the president from
getting the quickest trauma room care because they were involved in a
It's not about quick trauma room care. JFK was dead with the head shot.
It's about how long it took to get JFK to the hospital.
Yes, he was dead, but probably only his wife and Clint Hill could see
that. (And I'm aware of Hill's thumb-down to the QM. And Steve Ellis told
Larry Sneed that Jim Chaney drove up to him and told him JFK had been shot
in the head and was surely dead.) That's beside the point. We're talking
about the POTUS, and you get him to emergency care as fast as possible no
matter what you know about his wounds. Which is what they did.
But you always
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have to question in terms of conspiracy at the slightest mention of
anything, presumably because you are seeking to shut down the discussion
by dismissing it out of hand.
I'm not trying to shut down anything nor can I. I'm trying to get to the
root cause of this exercise. Just about anything you post on here is with
conspiracy as the objective.
Maybe JFK's apparently long ride to Parkland
Post by firstname.lastname@example.org
has nothing to do with a conspiracy. But what's wrong with trying to
understand what happened? We seem to have two specific times. JFK shot at
12:31. JFK admitted at 12:38. Why does a 3-minute ride take 7 minutes?
It's a perfectly reasonable question.
There you are. "Maybe . . . has nothing to do with a conspiracy." MAYBE.
There's nothing wrong with questioning the time, but to what purpose?, is
Here's more from DPD motorcycle Sgt. Ellis about the ride from Dealey to
"As we approached Harry Hines, it was almost a square turn; there was a
high bank over on the side. All I could see was that big, tall, green bank
and hoping I'd stay stay on the ground going around that. Chaney and I
were side by side with [B.J.] Martin somewhere behind us and the
President's car right on my tail. I was kind of teed off at the agent for
staying so close. Chaney would look back, and I'd look back; we'd speed up
and look back and there he was on our back bumper. I don't care how fast
we went the bumper of the President's car looked like it was right behind
us. He was directly behind us all the way to Parkland! They shouldn't ride
that close on an escort because if we had to take some evasive action or
brake, they'd run over us. We didn't like that too much but it couldn't be
helped under the circumstances."
From Sneed's NO MORE SILENCE, 146-47.
The problem with jumping to the question of conspiracy, which of course I
do believe is the case, is that you fail to examine the evidence. You seek
to shut down discussion of the evidence by forcing your own bias into the
discussion, your bias that it could not have been a conspiracy. Thus, your
training in "how to think about claims of conspiracy" has prevented you
from considering the evidence. In my case, my bias in favor of there being
a conspiracy has caused me to consider the evidence. Your bias causes you
to dismiss it.
Actually I came into this case believing in conspiracy. Over the years,
after a lot of studying of both sides, I had to come to the conclusion
that there is no evidence of conspiracy. (But perhaps I'm wrong, since YOU
have "considered" the evidence and I apparently have not.)
No, I'm not trying to shut down your chase after your own wishful
thinking. I am saying its silly because the evidence shows the opposite.
Of all the CTs I've encountered over the years, your are the first to
include the race to Parkland in his conspiracy. But you go right ahead.
Dig deep and hard.
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In this particular example, I am suspicious that the ride to Parkland took
longer than it should have in the furtherance of a conspiratorial purpose.
But, it seems to me, before I jump to such a conclusion, I should
determine whether or not the ride did indeed take longer than it should
If the ride took longer than it should have, then it is consistent with my
suspicion, even though that would not necessarily prove the case. If the
ride took just as long as it should have, then that would disprove this
particular suspicion of mine. Therefore, the thing to do is for me to try
to find out how long the ride took.
The best evidence I've seen suggests that it took between 5 and 7 minutes.
I think it should have taken 3 to 4 minutes, a 2 to 3 minute difference. 2
to 3 minutes doesn't sound like much, but it's almost 100% of the expected
ride time, that is, it looks as if the ride took almost twice as long as
it should have.
Also, the Miller photo suggests a very slow highway speed on the Stemmons
Freeway, at a time when you would expect Greer to have the pedal to the
Suggests. Are you a professional at interpreting what photographs show? If
so advise us of your credentials. And do you know at what point during the
trip on Stemmons the photo was taken?
You ignore what Ellis told Sneed. Was it Greer who was trying to lengthen
the time it took to get JFK to Parkland? Or Ellis and Chaney? Or all
Did the Washington-based Secret Service agents--who had become fond of
JFK, his wife and his children--conspire with the "right-wing Dallas cops"
to destroy the Kennedy presidency? There's a little real life humanity for
you versus your conspiracy robots.
Do you believe that just about every member of the DPD escort was involved
in the murder or the cover-up?
And not one of them had his guilty conscience get the best of him, and
tattletaled on the others? For 55 years? Not one whistleblower?
Post by firstname.lastname@example.org
This does not prove conspiracy. Doris Nelson could be mistaken. But her
testimony as we have it, and the ambiguity in the radio traffic regarding
an arrival time, and the Miller photo showing an apparent slow speed, all
suggest that Greer did not get to the hospital as quickly as he could
have, and that is consistent with my conspiracy suspicions.
You're correct about that. None of those items prove conspiracy to delay
the arrival at Parkland.
From FIVE DAYS IN NOVEMBER by Clint Hill with Lisa McCubbin, here is what
Hill has to say about the race to Parkland:
"Nothing else is said as we speed down Stemmons Freeway at about eighty
miles an hour. I turn my head and my sunglasses blow off."
"We turn off the expressway, the car still going very fast. I shift my
body weight to make sure I don't fall off, leaning into the turn, hands
and arms on one side of the car, feet and legs on the other. It is a
"Time has stopped. It feels like an eternity before we arrive at the
hospital. In reality, it has been just four minutes since the shots rang
out in Dealey Plaza." (Quotes from pages 108-109.)
Is Hill part of your conspiracy? Is he lying to cover-up what you are
alleging about the pace to Parkland?
Here's Bugliosi from page 51 of RH:
"The motorcade fast approaches Harry Hines Boulevard, where they'll have
to navigate a forty-five-degree left turn toward Parkland Hospital. Just
before Harry Hines, the road rises sharply to cross a railroad grade. The
motorcycle escorts are familiar with the turn, but limousine driver Bill
Greer is not, and he pushes the president's car faster, moving dangerously
close to the motor jockeys. With the limousine's front grill barking at
their heels, the police escorts hit the rise wide open, go airborne, and
nearly lose control as they slam to earth in the middle of the boulevard,
thirty feet away. On contact, the Harley-Davidson motorcycles bank hard
into the left turn, sparks kicking up from their footstands dragging
across the pavement. The president's car is right behind them, hitting the
rise with a WHUMP!, then into the turn on squealing tires. Greer is doing
all he can to handle the careening limousine, which bumps J.W. Courson's
motorcycle briefly into the curb. The men frantically pull out of the turn
and accelerate toward the emergency entrance of Parkland Hospital
three-quarters of a mile up the road. It's a wonder they haven't wrecked