Discussion:
Wisely, LNers are abandoning McWatters' Commission testimony
(too old to reply)
donald willis
2018-04-17 14:30:52 UTC
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Raw Message
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.

Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....

dcw
claviger
2018-04-18 01:55:50 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
donald willis
2018-04-18 22:09:42 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.

McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....

dcw
Bud
2018-04-20 02:28:30 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound
What makes it "sound"?
Post by donald willis
and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
Steve BH
2018-04-20 02:29:02 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.

So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
donald willis
2018-04-21 00:23:08 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!

Steve BH, without a paddle....

dcw
Bud
2018-04-21 20:01:41 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
Post by donald willis
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
donald willis
2018-04-23 02:27:56 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
No, it's on the record. Bud... without a paddle
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
Bud
2018-04-24 00:54:24 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
No, it's on the record. Bud... without a paddle
It isn`t on record that either of these witnesses were pressured. That
idea is the product of your imagination.
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
donald willis
2018-04-25 01:27:05 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
No, it's on the record. Bud... without a paddle
It isn`t on record that either of these witnesses were pressured. That
idea is the product of your imagination.
It is on record, however, that Jones had a very different version of the
bus trip. See my second post yesterday--Jones' version involves several
policemen and an hour's wait while they interrogated the bus riders.
You'll find none of this in McWatters. Apparently, Jones took a later
bus.

Long & short: McWatters' "teenager" could not have been Jones; it more
probably was the elderly Oswald, after all....

LNers would, wisely, also abandon Jones....

dcw
Anthony Marsh
2018-04-25 22:24:54 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
No, it's on the record. Bud... without a paddle
It isn`t on record that either of these witnesses were pressured. That
idea is the product of your imagination.
You mean the ones who were threatened? That doesn't count as being
pressured? Threatened with deportation?
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
Bud
2018-04-30 22:30:01 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Whatever your silly ideas require, that must be what happened.
No, it's on the record. Bud... without a paddle
It isn`t on record that either of these witnesses were pressured. That
idea is the product of your imagination.
You mean the ones who were threatened? That doesn't count as being
pressured? Threatened with deportation?
<snicker> Random neural firings.
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Post by Bud
Post by donald willis
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
Steve BH
2018-04-21 20:47:43 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
No, YOU are the one drifting through your own paranoia. McWatters didn't
make up some teenager who didn't exist. Why make up a 17 year-old? Why not
21? Milton Jones (actually Roy Milton Jones) was a real person, and was
the guy McWatters took to Oak Cliff. He lived two blocks away, and took
the same bus on Nov 23. The same bus he usually did, as it dumped him off
in Oak Cliff two blocks from where he lived (he went to school part time
and work part time). And he remembered Oswald, though his testimony isn't
in the WC report (if it is to faked, why not put it in? Conspiracy
theorists think the 100 page testimony of De Morhenschildt is from a fake
CIA operative, so why not a paragraph here?)

The problem is Oswald had a bus transfer in his pocket. One that would
have allowed him to go far out into East Dallas, at the other end of
McWatters' line. But not into Oak Cliff. He got it from a particular bus
line and a particular bus driver (McWatters), who were identified and
identifiable BY THE TRANSFER. He got them Nov. 22. He got them minutes
after the assassination.

You think Oswald took the wrong bus to Oak Cliff (a line that ended eight
blocks from where he lived, not the one he normally took that stopped
practically at his front door)? Why? If he went all the way southwest
over the river to Oak Cliff, why ask for a transfer to take him all the
way northeast to East Dallas, later in the day? Was he going up to see his
old friend General Walker? But decided to catch a matinee down on
Jefferson instead?

YOU ARE UP THE CREEK. You have zero explanation for any of the items in
Oswald's pockets, except CONSPIRACY! CONSPIRACY! CONSPIRACY!

We have a man to frame for the murder of the president! Call the
teenagers of Oak Cliff!
donald willis
2018-04-23 02:38:52 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
Steve BH, without a paddle....
dcw
No, YOU are the one drifting through your own paranoia. McWatters didn't
make up some teenager who didn't exist. Why make up a 17 year-old? Why not
21?
The younger, generally, the more malleable, easier to convince.

dcw CUT
donald willis
2018-04-23 02:40:34 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, April 21, 2018 at 1:47:44 PM UTC-7, CUT
Post by Steve BH
dcw
No, YOU are the one drifting through your own paranoia. McWatters didn't
make up some teenager who didn't exist. Why make up a 17 year-old? Why not
21? Milton Jones (actually Roy Milton Jones) was a real person, and was
the guy McWatters took to Oak Cliff.
Doubtful. In his affidavit, McWatters said that the man behind the woman
was the one who "had told me that president was shot in the temple".

In his testimony, McWatters said that "some gentleman in front of me in a
car... said 'The President... has been shot".

Jones provides yet a THIRD account: "[Jones] recalled that at this time a
POLICEMAN notified the driver the President had been shot...."

The cover-up advisers seemed to have had the devil's own time re-assigning
the "president was shot in the temple" speech from Oswald to an anonymous
"gentleman" to a "policeman"--i.e., anyone but for God's sake not Oswald!

It gets worse for the claim that Jones was on the bus with McWatters and
Oswald. To continue with Jones: The policeman in question here "told the
driver no one was to leave the bus until police officers had talked to
each passenger.... Two police officers boarded the bus and checked each
passenger to see if any were carrying firearms.... Jones estimated the bus
was held up by the police for about one hour...." (CE 2641/FBI report
4/3/63)

McWatters had a long and winding testimony, but I just re-checked it, and
I believe that nowhere did he mention police boarding the bus, talking to
passengers, and holding the bus for about an hour. That would have been a
pretty significant event, and McWatters seems to have said NOT ONE WORD
about it. Nor does he suggest that his "gentleman" was a "policeman"!

Sounds like Jones was on a later bus, if there's anything at all to his
story, when and if the cops perhaps started fanning out around the Dealey
area.

dcw
Caeruleo
2018-04-25 01:36:06 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
You and I have gone through this before, Donald. It is rather
questionable, to put it mildly, whether or not Euins initially described
the shooter as "colored." He was claimed to have said that second-hand
only.
donald willis
2018-04-26 00:53:28 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
You and I have gone through this before, Donald. It is rather
questionable, to put it mildly, whether or not Euins initially described
the shooter as "colored." He was claimed to have said that second-hand
only.
By two reporters for two different outlets. Plus a cop relayed a (second
hand!) report from a witness who said the shot came from the "second
window from the end", and the only such open window in the upper right
hand corner of the depository (as the cop described it) was on the 5th
floor, where, yes, a "colored" man was photographed. Obviously, if there
were to be any sort of effective cover-up, there could be no first-hand
reports of this. (In a related issue, this was pretty clearly a
mis-observation by all concerned, but I'm pretty sure they thought they
saw this--"they" being Euins and the "second window" witness....

dcw
Caeruleo
2018-05-17 03:05:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
You and I have gone through this before, Donald. It is rather
questionable, to put it mildly, whether or not Euins initially described
the shooter as "colored." He was claimed to have said that second-hand
only.
By two reporters for two different outlets.
Apparently you have, shall we say, "conveniently forgotten" what I told
you back then about *White* people interviewing *Black* people in 1963.
I went into great length about how very often, whether the white person
was a police officer or a reporter or whatever, the white person quite
often either did not take seriously, and/or misunderstood what the black
person said? Remember how, in reply to me, you barely addressed that
issue, and most certainly did not address that issue in nearly as much
detail as I did?
Post by donald willis
Plus a cop relayed a (second
hand!) report from a witness who said the shot came from the "second
window from the end",
We went through that as well, remember? And "a witness," singular? Oh
wow, that's considered "credible" by the majority of humans
worldwide...not.
Post by donald willis
and the only such open window in the upper right
hand corner of the depository (as the cop described it) was on the 5th
floor,
Where no *additional* *corroborative* evidence was found that any shot was
fired from that floor. Have you "conveniently forgotten" what I said to
you about Luke Mooney also, and how you had a good deal of trouble
refuting what I said in any even remotely plausible manner?
Post by donald willis
where, yes, a "colored" man was photographed.
Of course he was photographed, since he was there. We went through all
that before as well, don't you remember? ;-)
Post by donald willis
Obviously, if there
were to be any sort of effective cover-up, there could be no first-hand
reports of this.
Nonsense. In the heat of the moment, many firsthand reports can be
mistaken. Haven't you yourself dismissed at least a few firsthand
reports? Oh wait, I don't need to ask that, since I've seen you do that
very thing many, many, many times. ;-)

Two words: Howard Brennan.

And i've seen you dismiss, ***MANY*** times, Amos Euins's own
***FIRSTHAND*** report, in his own words...not paraphrased by someone
else, but instead in his own words. You take the word of what two
reporters claimed, secondhand, that he said, but you ignore his own exact
words *firsthand*.

Mmhmm, yep.

(In a related issue, this was pretty clearly a
Post by donald willis
mis-observation by all concerned, but I'm pretty sure they thought they
saw this--"they" being Euins and the "second window" witness....
dcw
donald willis
2018-05-18 00:05:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
You and I have gone through this before, Donald. It is rather
questionable, to put it mildly, whether or not Euins initially described
the shooter as "colored." He was claimed to have said that second-hand
only.
By two reporters for two different outlets.
Apparently you have, shall we say, "conveniently forgotten" what I told
you back then about *White* people interviewing *Black* people in 1963.
I went into great length about how very often, whether the white person
was a police officer or a reporter or whatever, the white person quite
often either did not take seriously, and/or misunderstood what the black
person said? Remember how, in reply to me, you barely addressed that
issue, and most certainly did not address that issue in nearly as much
detail as I did?
Does this mean that we can dismiss the Commission interviews with
Williams, Norman, and Jarman? At least, I'd guess that most of counsel
and company were white.... And from my own personal experience, I'll add
that I had a black friend who never failed to make himself quite clear to
any and all his interlocutors, no matter their color.
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Plus a cop relayed a (second
hand!) report from a witness who said the shot came from the "second
window from the end",
We went through that as well, remember? And "a witness," singular? Oh
wow, that's considered "credible" by the majority of humans
worldwide...not.
Ah! Never underestimate the power of snide-ness.... And don't forget that
there were a half dozen witnesses who said the shooter was at a wide open
window, such as the second window from the end on the fifth floor, but
pointedly NOT the so-called "sniper's nest".

And don't forget that I usually note that the first major transcription of
the DPD radio transmissions incorrectly ID'd the officer who sent the
"second window" message, and that the DPD sent the wrong officer to the
Commission hearings to say that he sent the message, thus "corroborating"
the phony transcription. The second major DPD transcription corrected
Henslee's "error", and the name of the officer who actually did send the
message blessedly ended up in the Warren Report!

Do you see a pattern? The DPD for some reason did not want you to know
the name of the "second window" witness. Yes, only one witness, here, but
apparently his ID would have been a tad controversial.
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
and the only such open window in the upper right
hand corner of the depository (as the cop described it) was on the 5th
floor,
Where no *additional* *corroborative* evidence was found that any shot was
fired from that floor. Have you "conveniently forgotten" what I said to
you about Luke Mooney also, and how you had a good deal of trouble
refuting what I said in any even remotely plausible manner?
Post by donald willis
where, yes, a "colored" man was photographed.
Of course he was photographed, since he was there. We went through all
that before as well, don't you remember? ;-)
Post by donald willis
Obviously, if there
were to be any sort of effective cover-up, there could be no first-hand
reports of this.
Nonsense. In the heat of the moment, many firsthand reports can be
mistaken. Haven't you yourself dismissed at least a few firsthand
reports? Oh wait, I don't need to ask that, since I've seen you do that
very thing many, many, many times. ;-)
Two words: Howard Brennan.
And i've seen you dismiss, ***MANY*** times, Amos Euins's own
***FIRSTHAND*** report
You're changing the subject. I said there would be no firsthand reports
SUGGESTING COVER-UP. Euins' firsthand report, months after the fact,
didn't reflect cover-up.


, in his own words...not paraphrased by someone
Post by Caeruleo
else, but instead in his own words. You take the word of what two
reporters claimed, secondhand, that he said, but you ignore his own exact
words *firsthand*.
Yes, months after the fact, after his family received threatening phone
calls, as per (the dreaded name) Mark Lane....

dcw

Anthony Marsh
2018-04-26 14:37:17 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Steve BH
Post by donald willis
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
McWatters' screwy testimony was the foundation on which witness Whaley,
the cab driver, built his house. A house is no better than its
foundation.
McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit is perfectly sound and straightforward, but
does not allow for cabs and cab drivers. That affidavit was Oswald's
alibi for the Tippit shooting, so it had to be dismantled, loony piece by
loony piece, in McWatters' Commission testimony. Hence, LNers have to
accept it or ignore it....
dcw
I'm sorry, but nobody would dismantle McWatters' testimony by actually
identifying the young man he took to Oak Cliff (and who initially he
thought was Oswald). They would never NAME that guy, as McWatters does for
the Warren Commission. That's too easy to check out. And if it didn't
check out I think we'd have heard about it as gov. conspiracy endlessly.
So, you're up the creek. McWatters made an initial mistake and corrected
it.
You must be kidding. It's so obvious that McWatters was yielding to
pressure, and a teenager could certainly be gotten to, too. Look at
Dealey witness Amos Euins, 15 years old or so, who initially said that the
man with the rifle was "colored", then completely withdrew that
description!
You and I have gone through this before, Donald. It is rather
questionable, to put it mildly, whether or not Euins initially described
the shooter as "colored." He was claimed to have said that second-hand
only.
OK, so maybe back them he used the word black. Are you going to quibble
about which term was popular that week?

What are you claiming is only second hand? You don't have a live recording
from Dealey Plaza? What is the point of your petty quibbling about
historic facts? Just to destroy history itself?

Are you saying we can't know if there was a a WWII unless YOU personally
were there?
mainframetech
2018-04-19 00:20:45 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
That doesn't explain McWatters. Maybe FBI or DPD intervention?

Chris
claviger
2018-04-20 02:36:49 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by mainframetech
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
That doesn't explain McWatters. Maybe FBI or DPD intervention?
Chris
What kind of intervention?
Anthony Marsh
2018-04-21 20:05:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by claviger
Post by mainframetech
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
That doesn't explain McWatters. Maybe FBI or DPD intervention?
Chris
What kind of intervention?
Suborning perjury.
Anthony Marsh
2018-04-20 18:19:06 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by mainframetech
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
That doesn't explain McWatters. Maybe FBI or DPD intervention?
Chris
Low IQ?
donald willis
2018-04-21 17:06:25 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by mainframetech
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
That doesn't explain McWatters. Maybe FBI or DPD intervention?
Chris
Low IQ?
Or no grace under pressure
Anthony Marsh
2018-04-19 12:45:32 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
Close. But you don't KNOW why Tippit stopped.
OHLeeRedux
2018-04-20 11:58:06 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Anthony Marsh
Post by claviger
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
LHO took a cab to Oak Cliff. He grabbed a jacket and a pistol then
went for a walk through the neighborhood where he shot a police
officer who stopped to speak with him.
Close. But you don't KNOW why Tippit stopped.
You don't know what you said ten minutes ago.
Bud
2018-04-18 19:19:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
It`s fine, unless your intentions is to play silly games.

Mr. McWATTERS - That is right. It was along about even with Griffin
Street before I was stopped in the traffic.
Mr. BALL - And that is about seven or eight blocks from the Texas Book
Depository Building, isn't it?
Mr. McWATTERS - Yes, sir. It would be seven, I would say that is seven, it
would be about seven blocks.
Mr. BALL - From there?
Mr. McWATTERS - From there, yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What did the man look like who knocked on your door and got on
your bus?
Mr. McWATTERS - Well, I didn't pay any particular attention to him. He was
to me just dressed in what I would call work clothes, just some type of
little old jacket on, and I didn't pay any particular attention to the man
when he got on-
Mr. BALL - Paid his fare, did he?
Mr. McWATTERS - Yes, sir; he just paid his fare and sat down on the second
cross seat on the right.
Mr. BALL - Do you remember whether or not you gave him a transfer?
Mr. McWATTERS - Not when he got on; no, sir.
Mr. BALL - You didn't. Did you ever give him a transfer?
Mr. McWATTERS - Yes, sir; I gave him one about two blocks from where he got
on.
Mr. BALL - Did he ask you for a transfer?
Mr. McWATTERS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Do you remember what he said to you when he asked you for the
transfer?

Mr. McWATTERS - Well, the reason I recall the incident, I had--there was a
lady that when I stopped in this traffic, there was a lady who had a
suitcase and she said, "I have got to make a 1 o'clock train at Union
Station," and she said, "I don't believe from the looks of this traffic
you are going to be held up."

She said, "Would you give me a transfer and I am going to walk on down,"
which is about from where I was at that time about 7 or 8 blocks to Union
Station and she asked me if I would give her a transfer in case I did get
through the traffic if I would pick her up on the way.

So, I said, "I sure will." So I gave her a transfer and opened the door
and as she was going out the gentleman I had picked up about 2 blocks
asked for a transfer and got off at the same place in the middle of the
block where the lady did.

This is Oswald, as corroborated by Mary Bledoe who was also on the bus
and knew Oswald and by the bus transfer.
Post by donald willis
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
BOZ
2018-04-18 19:20:04 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
We never gave up on McWatters. We gave up on you.
donald willis
2018-04-19 12:49:04 UTC
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Post by BOZ
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony. There's no defending
the indefensible. It's a thankless task.
Unfortunately (for LNers), that meandering, self-contradictory testimony
was intended to undermine McWatters' 11/22/63 affidavit and lineup ID of
O, which pretty much let O off the hook for Tippit's murder. If, as
McWatters indicates, O went by bus to Marsalis Ave., in Oak Cliff, then he
got there too late to get to the rooming house (and his pistol), then
10th....
dcw
We never gave up on McWatters. We gave up on you.
Well, yes, McWatters is good for comic relief
Caeruleo
2018-04-25 01:35:45 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.

"Just a thought."

:P
donald willis
2018-04-26 00:50:22 UTC
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Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....

dcw
Caeruleo
2018-05-03 00:38:03 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....
I don't.
donald willis
2018-05-04 00:25:18 UTC
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Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....
I don't.
Yet here you are....
Caeruleo
2018-05-17 02:59:42 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....
I don't.
Yet here you are....
Your "logic," such as it is, Donald, is, to put it mildly, rather
convoluted. One can quite easily be "here" without supporting a lost
cause. The fact of a person posting in this newsgroup has no direct
relevance to whether or not that person supports a lost cause.

Ah, but you knew that years ago, correct? ;-)
Caeruleo
2018-05-17 03:03:01 UTC
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Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....
That's certainly the pot calling the kettle black since you're the one who
didn't know how fast or slow a freight elevator traveled, even the typical
freight elevator more than a decade after the assassination, and yet still
jumped to obvious unsupported assumptions related to that, and tried to,
um, "prove," based on practically no real photographic analysis of your
own that at least one of the three black men was not present in a certain
photograph when he quite obviously was (based on very poor reproductions
in books only), and then refused to even *try* to address the business of
certain documents not being handwritten by people who have been mistakenly
claimed for more than a half-century to have written those documents in
their own handwriting...

Remember how I pointed out to you that you are no more of a photographic
expert than you are a handwriting expert, and how you blatantly evaded me
in article after article after article and thread after thread after
thread, something I did to you far more seldom than you did it to me?

Just a thought. ;-)
donald willis
2018-05-18 00:02:57 UTC
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Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Post by Caeruleo
Post by donald willis
Not surprised that LNers have pretty much given up supporting bus driver
Cecil McWatters' labyrinthine Commission testimony.
Not surprised that CTers continue to falsely claim that LNers have "given
up" on this, when the vast majority of them still support it in spades.
So glad to hear that. I empathize with those who support lost, not to say
hopeless, causes....
That's certainly the pot calling the kettle black since you're the one who
didn't know how fast or slow a freight elevator traveled, even the typical
freight elevator more than a decade after the assassination
Was this you or John King who was pushing this? At any rate, I don't
think it had much bearing on anything.... I do remember he made a good
point re walking upstairs vs walking downstairs (in fast/slow terms) ....

, and yet still
Post by Caeruleo
jumped to obvious unsupported assumptions related to that, and tried to,
um, "prove," based on practically no real photographic analysis of your
own that at least one of the three black men was not present in a certain
photograph when he quite obviously was (based on very poor reproductions
in books only)
You're lumping at least two different sources together, and the
reproductions are actually not that bad. The (wide angle) Dillard photo
as seen in the WR is actually pretty good: You can see Mr. Wilson
clearly; you just can't see anyone on the fifth floor. And the (same wide
angle) Dillard photo in Pictures of the Pain is rendered well--except that
Wilson's image is now fainter, though now you can see someone on the fifth
floor! King could never quite get this, though he sent me on some fine
wild goose chases all over the internet. On the whole, however, it was a
salutary experience, for which I thank Mr. King--I found some very
interesting photos new to me, but nothing which could explain how PARTS of
a photo could become clearer and other parts of the same photo less clear,
in subsequent reproductions--and I doubt if you could either....

, and then refused to even *try* to address the business of
Post by Caeruleo
certain documents not being handwritten by people who have been mistakenly
claimed for more than a half-century to have written those documents in
their own handwriting...
I should not have addressed that issue at all since, as you note, I did
not follow up on it! Mea culpa

dcw
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